In this occasion, KALM had the opportunity to interview a very special guest called Radinka Basuki or affectionately known as Dinka. She was diagnosed with Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD) since in the first year of primary school. However, Dinka did not let her ADHD defined who she is and restrict her from exploring to various places in the world. Since 2013, Dinka packed up her life and moved to Nairobi, Kenya to further her Masters study in Anthropology. Prior to her journey to Kenya, she lived in the United States of America and New Zealand.
Hey Dinka! Please share with us your life story up to the point of where you are living in different countries? What led you to it?
Good question! Actually, it is quite often for me to find myself accidentally in various places. I love to go to destinations that are not mainstream, such as India, Myanmar, and do unpopular activities like hitch-hiking. I do all of it because I like challenges and adventures. Something that can be seen from different point of views everyday. Do new things everyday!
Personally, what do you feel when you left Indonesia to live on those countries?
I feel it’s somehow calming. I love challenges. Living in war-torn countries like Kenya or traveling to neighbouring countries such as Democratic Republic of Congo, Ethiopia, borders of Somalia, and Sudan. I am addicted to the adrenaline rush, the feeling when my brain is triggered by it, not knowing what will happen next, it feeds my curiosities, being a nosy person. In my opinion, being nosy is not something negative. If not, we won’t know what is happening! Through the adrenaline rush, I feel a pleasing sensation, scary yet calming.
What made you think to move to Kenya?
Initially, I registered to be a volunteer with Voluntary Services Overseas (VSO). They have lots of programs in various countries, one of them is in Kenya. I chose places where english is not the primary language. Then, I made another registration to go to Ethiopia, just to learn something different. But, there was no vacancy. About a month later, an offer to work with an organisation that helps in special needs children in Kenya arrived. Kenyan use Swahili for their daily conversations. From then on, I was hooked because I can learn a new language and I perceived that as a challenge.
What are the bad and good times for Dinka while living in Kenya?
A lot! The corruption in Africa, especially where I live is massive. It made me become so thankful to be an Indonesian. Even though we complain a lot, like the recent power outage, well sorry, it happened. But, in Nairobi, cases like no electricity and limited access to clean water are common. So, i am very thankful when I got the chance to leave countries like Kenya and to be able to drink clean water instead of tap water over there. Sadly, things that are supposed to be basic necessity are seen as luxuries. Such as clean water, 24 hours electricity, and clean environment. The good thing is that Kenya has an amazingly pristine air.
In regards to corruption in the country, well it affects the business that I have there. It really bothers me up to the point that my family said, “Why are you staying there if you can’t even help the poor people and make you to be even poorer?” Although it is true, but it’s a challenge that I was seeking for. It is not cool when people see it, but there are challenges that make it to be more. It really trains my mentality to be stronger and more strict.
It seems like there are a lot of limitations that Dinka encountered in Africa, how do you handle it?
I lived in a village outside of Nairobi with the Maasai tribe. It’s very nice, fun. The scenery is like in the Lion King movie, but access to the city is very hard because of the traffic jam. Maasai tribe is nomadic and they are cow herders, which sometimes caused the traffic. The infrastructure is still disappointing and the drivers are not exactly adhere to the rules. But, with the introduction of Uber, the “gojek” over there, it became bearable, compared to when I arrived.
How do I get out of it, how do I navigate it? Fortunately, I lived in nature, next to the Nairobi National Park. It’s the safari. I am an animal lover since I was a kid and now I lived nearby elephants and giraffes conservatories. Having interactions with animals or just seeing them became a healing process for me.
Another thing is because of the perfect combination between Africa and Coffee. I drink it daily and it is a part of my healing process. The crisp air allows me to walk around everywhere. So, there are a lot of ways for me to navigate from my problems and achieve mental wellness. Also, by not having high expectations.
Because of the many challenges, one of the coping strategies is to lower down our expectations. Don’t even have any, both professionally and personally. If we could not reach them, it will be super painful. Over in Africa, i don’t have any support systems, family, or friends. I do have a small circle of close friends. All of the Indonesians who lived in the country have their own busyness, so I can’t really depend on them. Fortunately, I am quite independent and like to do things on my own. If you would like to be comfortable just on your own, there will be ways. Unlike here, where the culture is communal and have to find a large group of people to hang out. I am not like that. I prefer to be alone and it really becomes my coping strategy.
May we know how Dinka became interested with mental wellness. Can you tell us the beginning?
If you want to know about my interest, it started when I was a kid. But, it grew bigger when I was 23 and was backpacking through India as well as during my time in New Zealand, especially during the winter and I got winter blues.
I began to feel unwanted sensations on my brain and body, I felt flat, dark, and hopeless. From there, I realized something was not right. I found it hard to wake up in the morning – i am not a morning person, but it was harder. My body felt so heavy, even though I was physically fine. I still could go for swims and yoga, but it was so heavy and felt like I was in prison. The New Zealand government do care a lot about mental wellness, not only for the native, but for immigrants. There are several free care or affordable ones provided, also several free hotlines. So, I rang up one of the hotlines to tell my stories.
The hotline is special for citizens aged 35 and below (youth). The counsellor on the phone asked, “how close are you to suicide?” “how big is the possibility of committing to suicide?”, they also asked “what’s your depressive level like?” “, and the most important thing for them is if I ever tried to take my own life or not. I never did. But, I was not insulted by their questions, because the exposures of fellow friends who are depressive and sad. Me, myself, love to watch documentaries and films. I am thankful that in New Zealand, mental illness is not a stigma. So, it is common if somebody said that he or she is depress, I have an anxiety attack, and it is the same as “I have a headache” in indonesia. So, based on my experiences, I often goes to counselling, once a week.
Dinka, what is mental wellness according to you?
Mental wellness is about internal health, our brain wellness, which I perceived as very important, and have to be balanced with our physical well-being. In fact, it has to be number one! If it’s possible, it should be discussed more in indonesia. Begins with just among friends. Then, as listeners, we have to be more open, don’t have to always responds, at least become good listeners.
What do you think of Indonesians understanding of mental wellness?
At a glance, it is lacking. Even within the family, I could not talk about it, mostly met with silence and or just, “oh yes, but you know how to handle it, right?” But, if you do make mistakes because of my impairment, they will have several nasty comments, like, “just blame your ADHD, it should be healed by now,” even though the reality is far from that. It can be said that the “damaged” is permanent to our neurosystem, which doesnt means we are stupid. It’s just the way we think, our ways to see things, just different compared to others because our brain cells are developed differently than others.
What about other countries Dinka used to lived?
I lived in the United States of America when I was a kid, it is quite different between the US, New Zealand, and Indonesia. In both countries, we were encouraged to find help as soon as possible about our mental wellness. If we feel down, we will definitely told to go the school counselors. They can do the assessments, because they are professional and certified.
But in African countries, including Kenya, there is still a big stigma about mental problems. For instance, if somebody has an acute panic attack or schizophrenia, it is considered as a taboo, and will be locked or hidden inside the house as well as being thought of as a non-existence. So, if there is an annual citizen census, they will not be included as a part of the family. Culture also has a hand on it.
The stigma appears because their cultures taught them to be like that, for instance about being possessed. Actually, it is almost similar with in Indonesia. But, in Indonesia might be a bit better compared to in the African countries. At least you have KALM here on instagram and people who are not confident about their mental wellness can talk to the kalmselors. On the other hand, people in other places outside of Jakarta might not be able to talk about it freely due to lack of exposures.
Previously Dinka mentioned about your condition as people with ADHD. But, what is ADHD?
So ADHD is Attention Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder, where those who have it find it hard to concentrate, lack of focus, hyperactive, and cant stay still. In adults, it can be seen in one place, but it can be vague. It is hard to stay still and you will always need to grab on to something.
One of the characteristics of ADHD is impulsiveness. We are very impulsive. For example, if we want to do something, it must be done, even though it might hurt us. Children for example like to touch electric sockets, because of their curiosities, just touch, without thinking of the pain. Usually the conditions start since we are children and can continue to adulthood, just like me.
One of the traits of people with ADHD is the unstable emotions. It’s the unpleasant part. So, usually in our interpersonal relationships with other individuals, relationships with partners, or husbands/wives, and our relationships with other professionals in the workplace are often disturbed because of our emotions. Because we could misunderstand, easily irked, and if we receive orders from our supervisors, it could be our uncomfortable triggers, and it will affect our moods.
Even though I know that in Indonesia, ADHD is often associated with children who are very active, loud, and academically challenged. So psychologists in Jakarta, because I only know this city, most of them only takes care of ADHD in children. Maybe they believe consuming drugs like Ritalin will cure it but actually the way the brain is wired is just different. That is why not a lot of people know, why our understanding about many things are different, we cannot read social cues, similar to people with autism, actually.When I was younger, I am very active, cannot stay still, and when I tell my stories it will go all over the place. We are also not familiar with the concept of time, we have different perceptions of time. For some reason, being on time is impossible. Not because we do not respect other people’s time, but because we take it for granted. For example, if we promise to arrive at 1 pm and its still 12 pm, we will go play games even though the appointment is in Menteng and we live in Cilandak. We thought of online taxi without thinking of the durations. So, roughly we don’t have concepts about time. It is hard for us to focus and have more energy. I love to walk, for example if I have extra energy, I will go for walks, swims, because it calms me down.
According to Dinka, what stigma given by the society about people with ADHD that are not true?
The stigma that we lack in focus is correct.
But we do have superpowers that people don’t realize: hyperfocus. For example, if we are given 5 tasks, people with ADHD in general cannot multitask, I can’t. When I do assignments, I will jump from one task to another, because it bored us. But, if we are given 1 task that we really like that stimulates our mental, body, the way we think, we can do it intensely from 1 pm to 8 pm. There will be breaks in between, but we will get it done. We are committed to do 1 task until its finish, but people will see us as lazy. But, if we use our hyperfocus, we will get it done. It is a daily stigma, even from our own families.The important thing is we know our strengths and weaknesses, and just make our weaknesses to be our superpowers. Everybody has their own powers.
But we do have superpowers that people don’t realize: hyperfocus. For example, if we are given 5 tasks, people with ADHD in general cannot multitask, I can’t. When I do assignments, I will jump from one task to another, because it bored us. But, if we are given 1 task that we really like that stimulates our mental, body, the way we think, we can do it intensely from 1 pm to 8 pm. There will be breaks in between, but we will get it done. We are committed to do 1 task until its finish, but people will see us as lazy. But, if we use our hyperfocus, we will get it done. It is a daily stigma, even from our own families.The important thing is we know our strengths and weaknesses, and just make our weaknesses to be our superpowers. Everybody has their own powers.
When did Dinka knows that you have ADHD?
I was first diagnosed when I was seven during my 1st year of primary school when I was 7 years old. I always go out of classes, teachers hated me, thought of me as disrespectful to them, naughty, I found it hard to study, could not concentrate, talked back, and could stand authorities. So after being diagnosed, it is still there, I remained the same because it is an impairment. That year, I found it hard to concentrate, my emotions went up and down, and could not follow authorities.
I also met a counselor in Jakarta when I become an adult, especially coming from Kenya because of it due to the expensive costs of treatments, different cultures, as well as the stigma about mental illness. I prefer talking to a professional here because they have the same context as I do. Which means they can understand where I come from when I talk about the mental illness that I have.
Unfortunately, I met somebody who was too theoretical and said that I am supposed to be cured already because I could go to work. In reality, I still have a lot of conflicts with my colleagues and supervisors in the corporate world, it affects both them and me personally and professionally. But I got through it all. I am a frank person. Then the psychologist said its the office politics, it happens everywhere. But it is not like that, I know what my triggers are. So when they told me I am cured and could go to work, it was incorrect. We can go to work, depending on what we like, and we will deliver what we like to do. But, we need to be dealt with differently even though it might sound needy. I know specifically what to do, for example not being in a room with a lot of people, prefer to be in a quiet place or in my own corner.
I also read about neurodiversity, where it is about damaged in our brains. The way we think is unique. Even several geniuses, if they don’t have ADHD, they are autistic or have Asperger’s. Like Albert Einstein or Will Smith. In one perspective, we are unique, but in here because of the glasses that people use we are thought of differently. We are perceived as annoying, hyperactive, and immature for adults like me. It’s one of the stigmas that people thought about me.
Because we could not multitask, we tend to find it hard to finish things. Maybe our levels of maturity are measured by our successes, how much money we have, our punctuality, the amount of friends we have, and our sociability. I often find it hard to make friends because of my introvert side. But it is considered as immaturity. We are adults, but we are different. Adults must be normal, but me, i am animative, so they think of me as a kid. So, its does not means that people like us are immature, but we are expected to be like that because of the society perceptions.
How do you handle people’s reactions at school, at work, when they know you have ADHD?
Well, my friends did not know. Just like when I was at college, they made fun of me saying I am autistic, “Ah, Dinka is autistic, she always prefers to be alone…” then I replied, “what if I am?” they will say, “No, don’t, that will be unfortunate”. I said, “If there is no autistic person, theory of relativism won’t exist.” Then they say, “Oh… that’s actually true,” so I gave references of famous figures who have mental illnesses.
But if people who are close to me have high expectations of me and cant accept my conditions, it hurts really bad. I cried a lot. I am an emotional being and crying helps me. Sharing about my struggles professionally also helps. I used to go to counselling for 3 years. I like to sit with people I can trust. Everybody, no matter who they are, they must have supporters, close friends who dont judge us, and accept us. One of my family members never judged. People like that are special, so we must treat them well, embrace them. But it will be difficult as we will ask to be understood, people with ADHD also have a high level of worries. It’s a part of our fluctuating emotions. Everytime I received negative criticisms, it went up. My ways of coping are by walking, be alone, take the MRT, go to any places that can get me out of the toxic situations. I will find excuses to go out of the room.
From your side, what does Dinka wants the society to know about people who have ADHD?
Read as much as you can, talk to them, their brains are developed in certain ways, the neurodiversity that I mentioned earlier like me, they are not the same as autistic people with no empathy. They do have big empathy, they have feelings, empathy is a part of emotion. Talk to the people with Asperger’s, those who are dyslexic, because they can’t see words in a normal way. Ask about their experiences. Once in a while, get to know them deeper. Get to know us! Don’t just be a listener, but interacts with us. If you want to talk with somebody who has something, be a good listener. Not everything has to be responded like in sit-coms. Be a good listener, its enough and meaningful for us.
For people who feels they have symptoms of mental health illnesses, according to Dinka, when can they know when to seek help?
As soon as you feel uncomfortable that day, browse. There are a lot of online platforms, even on Instagram account like KALM, that can help. Do online counseling or send an email, it will be replied, if you don’t want to do face-to-face. I started with face-to-face, because it felt comfortable.
If you are not yet comfortable, go to the Kalmselor through KALM App, try the free trial. Don’t feel guilty because of going to a professional. You need to know when you don’t feel good mentally, its okay. Get the help you need!
Personally, when did Dinka feel that you need help?
I realized that I was depressed when I was 23, living alone in New Zealand. After that, everything became all about me. It is egoistical, because if I don’t feel good with myself, I will focus on me. Even though I missed chances to hangouts, because I prefer to be alone. But now, my social life is better. If people invite me, I don’t analyze whether they will be nosy about me, there are negative voices, but I can now feel their sincerities and said yes to their invites. Don’t be an extreme loner, it is important to socialize. We can be introverts, but because I am curious about other people, so I make time to meet them. I believe that people are comfortable with my presence, then I will go. What is important is that I managed to do it, every second counts. Do what makes you feel comfortable.
How did Dinka find help for your depression?
When I was in New Zealand, every week I would go to counseling. I worked for an NGO at that time and had a good salary. Fortunately, in New Zealand was able to find an institution where the counseling fees were subsidized by the country, so I just paid as I could. With my salary, I am thankful that I could consistently go to the counseling every Friday and I anticipated it, because I have lots of stories to tell.
Counseling is not just telling stories when you are sad, but when you are happy. Whatever I shared, it will be assessed by psychologists. They assessed on the way I think, which methodology works best for me. So we are assisted in our daily routines with specific methods. That is when Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) comes in. People with depression, whether because of ADHD like me or other brain impairment, they also have patterns that make them down. Those patterns with CBT, a therapy that changed the way people think, act, and behave daily. For us, if we could not wake up, write in a diary, there is help.
If not mistaken, Dinka did went home to Indonesia just to meet a psychologist for your depression. Why did you do it?
It is uncomfortable, my anxiety level went up and down. I spoke enough about sickness like ADHD, autism, and online assessment. But, online assessment is not that accurate. So, if you read online, I can be categorized between ADHD and Asperger. The most ethical thing I see is when we meet professionals. From then on, I think to return to Indonesia just to get it done.
Did your meeting with psychologist produced a positive result for you?
After I got my diagnosis, it felt good, knowing the causes, and being able to name my condition. There are people who think of it as labels and its fine, to each their own. But for me, it is comforting, healing, and its different for people. I suggest if you feel restless mentally, seeks help. It is common. If you don’t want it to continue, get to know how to overcome it. For me, it is comforting to know the name of my condition.
Has Dinka ever try online counseling?
I did try online counseling, even though I go for the face-to-face ones more often. But KALM through its online counseling application helped me to find a psychologist that diagnosed my ADHD. I read and tell them about my experiences with mental wellness. I spoke to the KALMselor not from the basic, I have prepared several questions for me to ask first to get my diagnosis. It was more focused because I did preliminary research.
KALM is a genius platform, because it is very calmful for those who don’t know what is counseling yet, why they need counseling. Is it a sharing platform? It’s just like talking to our friends? Actually not, it’s very professional. When I was in Kenya and there is a 5 hours time difference, my KALMselor is very accommodating. We set our times. Because I like counselling, so it makes me to be on time. We are ready and the Kalmselor dedicate their times for a week and said “Okay Dinka, success!” I did not feel judged or awkward, because I am ready, I know what I have to ask. Maybe you will different experiences, there will be those who are still shy or sceptical. But try, at least the 3 days trial. Please use it!
We have been sharing a lot, Do Dinka has messages that you would like to share with KALMers who are experiencing those issues or those who would like to know about it?
The most crucial message for KALMers, is to accept who you are regardless. Regardless of our conditions, make friends with it. If you know you have depression and anxieties, don’t make it your enemy. It is a part of us. It makes us stronger and build our characters. Survive, even though the situation is not what we are hoping for. If you feel hopeless, where live is meaningless, and you think about ending it, dont. Don’t feel guilty, or not enough praying or anything, it is not that.
Forget about regrets, it is our journeys, accept it. Don’t think about it all as weaknesses, but strengths, our superpowers. Anxiety, depressions, they are our friends. The more we embrace them with our methods, our ways of healings, by walking alone or listen to music or watch movies, it will gradually disappears. It’s not permanent. It is hard, accept who we are. Breathe in and breathe out. Breathing is important, whether it is meditation or praying. Monitor our breathings. When we are depressed, or angry, or worries, our breathing becomes abnormal, faster. Monitor it and watch our emotions when we exhale. Believe me it is not permanent. So stay, we need you, the world needs you, KALM needs you. I experienced it, still do, but I am still here, so you have to as well.
What is your hope for the understanding of mental wellness in Indonesia?
I have a very high hope. Please make it into more conversation. Talk about it often and do informative sessions at schools, universities, and every public spaces. Make affordable workshops, because professional interventions in Indonesia are expensive. I hope in the future it will be affordable for people. I wish that all parts of society can access psychology service and learn about their problems. It is very important. I hope that a curriculum about mental wellness is in the curriculum in Indonesia. We need to learn about it and become human with empathy.
Okay, Dinka, thank you so much to spend your times with KALM!
If one of you feels you are struggling with your mental health, do not hesitate to talk to a professional counselor through KALM App.
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